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Two interviews, firstly from Reader Views after the 2011 release of The Human Hologram. Then from
The World Audience Review after the 2008 release of The Human Antenna.

The 2011 interview with Tyler R. Tichelaar from Reader  Views.

Tyler: Welcome, Robin and thank you for the opportunity to interview you about your new book “The Human Hologram.” To begin, will you explain the title to us—what do humans and holograms have to do with one another?

Robin: In recent years, both the two leading popular science magazines in the western world, “The Scientific American” and “The New Scientist” presented credible evidence that we live as holographic beings within a holographic universe. The mathematics suggest that, more fundamental to our perceived four dimensions, there is an underlying matrix of interfering fields of information—a unified field. So if this is the case, then it follows that it is our brain and senses that create the perception of a time-based material world and universe. We are a part of this world and universe, so it also follows that our very bodies, in their most fundamental state, must also exist in this form.

Tyler: Robin, could you define exactly what a hologram is in layman’s terms?

Robin: This is much easier to describe with diagrams, as in the book. However here goes! A manmade hologram is a three dimensional ghost like image, a true 3D photograph if you like, that has two prominent properties. Firstly, that of real parallax where the image appears to remain in a fixed position when viewed from different angles. And secondly, it has a fractal nature whereby all parts of the whole are contained in the smallest part. (Third Guiding Principle of The Human Hologram, page 99)
The pioneering research into holograms won Denis Gabor a Nobel Prize in 1971, although his work started in 1947. He had to wait until laser light could be produced in 1960.
Briefly, a laser beam is split into two with one part aimed at the object to be “photographed.” The other part, a reference beam, is aimed at a mirror. The two beams are then set up to collide, causing an interference pattern that is recorded on a special photographic plate. The hologram is formed when a fresh laser beam is aimed at this plate.
I speculate in the book that a similar process occurs within our brains and visual tracks, helping us create the perception of a three-dimensional world.

Tyler: That’s really interesting, Robin. You just mentioned the Third Guiding Principle, but will you briefly tell us a little about the Ten Guiding Principles of the Human Hologram in your book?

Robin: After a couple of introduction chapters, I embarked upon presenting the scientific evidence that could support such a radical theory. I am conscious that for many without a formal scientific education that reading about holographic, quantum, and fractal science could be daunting. So I tried to make this section entertaining (fun even!), exploring the life, minds, and passions of the scientists who have explored these realms over the past two centuries. To help the lay reader further, I have summarized the most important scientific facts and theories with Ten Guiding Principles that support the argument. For example the Tenth Principle states:
“Viable working models of The Human Hologram are emerging based on an understanding of the primacy of information, and consciousness. Traditional philosophies such as those from India and China are based on this primacy of consciousness. Our four dimensional space-time existence is seen as a consequence of other hidden dimensions, which in turn are vitally enhanced by its presence.”

Tyler: If humans are “holographic,” what is the significance of knowing that information? What difference does it make for us as a species, and for us individually in our daily lives?

Robin: This is really the core issue I address in the book. The holographic paradigm recognizes that all of the information of the whole can be accessed by the smallest part—“as above so below.” And so, the participation of each and every one of us has a far greater influence than we have been conditioned to believe. So our actions potentially feed instantly into the unified field—positive acts, e.g. kindness, enhance the field—the field upon which we form.
It is through our feelings that we connect to the field—it is through our thoughts that we figure out how best to enhance it. The “heart” of the book is largely dedicated to the science that lies behind our feelings.

Tyler: Robin, will you give us an example from your book of how we can use this information and understanding of ourselves as holographic to improve our lives now and in the future?

Robin: It is important we learn to trust our true feelings, and learn to express them where necessary. At all times, we should act with integrity, showing compassion to others and ourselves. Of course, this compassion should spread to our planet and all living beings.

Tyler: Robin, I mentioned when I introduced you that you are interested in Eastern medicines, and in “The Human Hologram,” you suggest that Eastern and Western medicine can meet and be connected. Will you expand on that idea for us a little?

Robin: As a formally trained doctor, I have combined Eastern and Western medicine in my family practice for thirty years. For me, there is no conflict, only balance. My studies of Eastern and modern mind-body-spirit philosophies help me to explore the deeper meaning behind people’s health and life challenges. For example, Chinese medicine has always recognized how our emotions and feelings are intimately connected to our health.
New branches of science—fractals, biophysics, neuroquantology—are exploring the role of connective tissue—our cytoskeleton, a fractal web of protein and water with crystalline properties that extends into every cell of our body. This cytoskeleton has electrical properties and evidence is emerging that the Chinese meridians are the “trunks and branches” of this tree-like system. It is proposed that the furthermost “twigs” of this cytoskeleton—our microtubules and other tiny antenna like spindles—act as foundries where the “quantum” field collapses down into our classical world.

Tyler: Robin, sometimes people are scared off by scientific books because they are afraid they won’t be able to understand them. Who would you say is your reading audience and how would you describe your ideal reader?

Robin: I hope my book is accessible to everyone, even those with only the most basic science education. The new science I explore is the science of beauty, form, intuition, and art—but retains all the logic of the science of the past.
Many of us have been conditioned into disliking science—which has been primarily a deductive, “masculine,” left-brained disciple. I remember really struggling with physics at school, and only just passed my exams. However, the new physics and science fills me with wonder. It is so much about opening our eyes to the patterns of Nature that surround us. Those that seem most in touch with this vision are children and teenagers.

Tyler: That’s interesting, Robin. Why do you think the younger generations are embracing this new view of science as opposed to older generations?

Robin: I think they are naturally curious with an incredible capacity to learn. But also computer games, and 3D movies such as “Avatar” are creating a virtual reality that intrigues them. So popular culture, and the digital information age, is causing us to ask questions about the nature of reality. Many young people are intrigued by such concepts as teleportation, time travel, and a unifying matrix—again movies such as “The Matrix” and the Harry Potter series are stimulating, and feeding into, this interest.

Tyler: Robin, people in the metaphysical world, whether we want to call them “New Age” or something else, talk about how there is a mass consciousness or a mass awakening beginning—a lot of books have pointed to this happening in 2012 in line with ancient Mayan and other cultures’ prophecies. Is there an “Age of Aquarius” type shift happening—do you think our understanding of this new science and the holographic universe is a sign of that shift, or are these ideas all speculation and fantasy in your opinion?

Robin: I think this new consciousness is already with us. Rather than look outside themselves for the signs, I encourage people to recognize the signs that are occurring within. In the holographic paradigm, these shifts are instantly connected to the “outside” world and cosmos. We are conditioned to fear change, and hence, the apocalyptic scenarios that are being promoted by some mainstream and extremist sources.
We are now more and more conscious of our connections to each other and the natural world—this to me is consistent with an Aquarian age which views the “Piscean” fish as being only able to survive if the water is abundant, fresh, and cared-for.

Tyler: Did you do a lot of research for the book or was most of it information you’ve learned as a doctor over the years?

Robin: I am continually researching—but I am also in the wonderful position of having people come every day to my practice who embody these theories. And so it is my daily life as a doctor that provides me with the most valuable information. It has also given me the opportunity to try to explain these philosophies to people of all ages and from all walks in life. Their feedback has further educated me, helping me write in a way that can hopefully be understood by as many as possible.

Tyler: Would you give an example of why you would explain that there’s a holographic universe to a patient? Do you do it to comfort them or to help them heal mentally in some way, or is it just because the patient brings it up as a subject of interest in general conversation?

Robin: I think the whole concept is reassuring for all those suffering from chronic illness, and crisis in their lives. An understanding that love, consciousness, and spirituality are perhaps more fundamental than possessions and material wealth, helps people gain true perspective on their lives. The existence of these non-material realms are supported by the Human Hologram theory. An understanding that consciousness is fundamental to our existence—also raises questions as to whether this survives our physical death.
On a practical level—and one of my main motives behind writing “The Human Hologram”—was to begin to explain why ear acupuncture works. I have used this every day in my practice for thirty years. Briefly the outer part of the ear, the auricle, contains energetically a map of the whole body—consistent with holographic theory. And so, for example, one tiny needle at a particular point in the upper part of the ear can instantly relieve someone of his back pain. This technique is used by U.S. military medics and paramedics on soldiers with acute injuries in Iraq and Afghanistan—thereby reducing their need for high doses of morphine.
The main criticism for this procedure has come from doctors and academics claiming there is no scientific theory that supports this technique.

Tyler: Would you say that knowing we are living in a holographic universe is “comforting”? Why or why not?

Robin: It is comforting, as it leads us to trust our feelings, and intuition while still honoring our rationality. If we learn these skills, we worry less and can cope better with the chaos and information overload of modern day living. It is also pleasing to know that little acts of kindness, to ourselves and others, feed and enhance into an underlying field of consciousness. This is both comforting and empowering.

Tyler: Many people are either creative or they are scientific/mathematical/logical, but you appear to be that odd mixture that is both. Do you consider yourself unusual or fortunate as a result? Where does creativity come into your writing about a scientific topic like “The Human Hologram?”

Robin: When we speak and write best, our feelings and our thoughts are in perfect harmony. There is even evidence emerging that in this state we pluck words from “quantum” realms.
And so after gathering my research, and creating a skeleton structure for my books, I then try to write creatively, from the heart. Writing is not just about the words themselves—it is also about space, rhythm, and poetry. Similarly, our DNA is not just a linear sequence of four letters (representing base pairs)—it contains the poetic rhythm of a language, or musical symphony.
I think I may be able to grasp some of these concepts because I have a so-called mixed laterality. For some activities, I am left-handed, for others I am right-handed, and for a few, I am truly ambidextrous. So I suspect I have a good balance between my left and right brain, with a healthy connecting “corpus callosum.” However, this is not always a blessing. Whereas I seemed to thrive at composing and writing essays at school and university, I had real difficulty (and still do) with multiple choice questions. I am concerned that many fail exams because of their difficulty to process information in this form.
However, my odd brain does seem to help in my songwriting—my other passion—as words and music come to me together, often fully formed as a song.

Tyler: Robin, I find your answer fascinating, and I especially am curious to know more about your comment that when we are writing at our best “in this state we pluck words from ‘quantum’ realms.” As an author myself, I’ve often had that experience where suddenly words just flow out of me, and later, I wonder where they came from or where I got the energy to write all those books. And you’ve probably heard of automated writing where someone from beyond the grave dictates a book to someone on this side of life. Are you suggesting there is some greater consciousness outside ourselves that inspires us when we write or speak? Maybe some sort of shared or mass consciousness we tap into?

Robin: Yes I am sure of this. I sometimes write things down either in prose or a song—that mean little at the time, only to be understood by me at a later date (sometimes years later!) For example, several years ago I wrote that creativity came from the future—it made no sense at the time!
I am fascinated by savants, often with autistic traits, who can tap instantly into a wealth of universal knowledge—say being able instantly to multiply 8,175 by 5,287. I also marvel at the genius of Shakespeare and Beethoven.
There is an emerging field known as “quantum cognition” for recognizing these quantum connections in our everyday language. Psychologists from the Queensland University of Technology in Australia have joined colleagues at the University of Florida to pioneer this fascinating new area of research.

Tyler: Robin, I mentioned when I introduced you that you’ve written a couple of other books. Will you tell us a little about them?

Robin: My first book “Healing Ways: A Doctor’s Guide to Healing” (Penguin Books, 2000) was my experience and research validating my East/West approach to practicing medicine. I was keen to explain the principles of Chinese medicine in ways that everyone could understand. How and why illnesses were so often linked to our emotional state. There were a lot of case studies and stories from my practice.
I also talked about quantum and holographic principles, and speculated that these sciences would become increasingly relevant to our daily lives. It was in general very well received, although one established doctor in his review for a popular medical magazine here stated that it was a book that should “never have been written!” That only convinced me that I needed to write more!
My next book “The Human Antenna—Reading the Language of the Universe in the Songs of Our Cells” (Energy Psychology Press, 2008) focused on how our health challenges and life events are intimately involved in the growth of our consciousness. Much was based on the chakras, the Kundilini and other Ayurvedic principles. Again many real life stories, together with the science of microtubules and holography.
My new book makes all of this even more relevant because of the new science showing quantum processes to be at work in plants and animals, at the temperatures and conditions that support life here on earth.

Tyler: Robin, will you explain a little why that reviewer thought your first book should “never have been written”? Was there something about your book he feared? Do you think modern science may feel threatened in some ways?

Robin: I think our profession is very wary of people making claims based on New Age or purely metaphysical principles. They are concerned that gullible people will literally take leave of their senses, and forego safe and effective medical care. In general, I have found people seeking my help are much more sensible, and informed, than that. The new science presented in this book helps explain why many phenomena once labeled “supernatural” can now be regarded as “natural.”
I think there are healthy skeptics—ones who question and listen, and make valued judgments—and those less healthy who are hanging onto conditioned negative beliefs, and fearful of change. These will resist change even if it is supported by good science. They fear losing control. I have found my words do not tend to penetrate their dogma—more likely life’s ups and downs (or having teenagers!) will have a greater influence.

Tyler: Robin, we’ve covered a lot of material in this interview. To sum it up, what would you say is the most important thing to understand or the concept you most want readers to come away with after reading “The Human Hologram”?

Robin: Learn to trust your feelings, be compassionate to yourself and others, and remain in a state of joy and wonder about the miracle of life.

Tyler: Perfect, Robin. So what’s next for you? More books, more music—a little of everything?

Robin: I continue to juggle the passions in my life—while not neglecting my wonderful family, and my busy medical practice. I am presently focusing on presentations, workshops, and media interviews inviting active debate on the issues raised in “The Human Hologram.” I am trying not to present any of this as dogmatic fact—rather, I am encouraging healthy debate so we can discover more of our true nature.
I continue to write and record more music, performing my songs in my presentations. This is an important and joyful part of my life—the music is available on iTunes, and I regularly post new songs on my website for free downloading, but I encourage people to make a donation to a child orphan charity, or a charity of their choice, if the music connects in any way.

Tyler: Thank you again, Robin, for a great interview. Before we go, will you tell us about your website and what additional information our readers can find there about “The Human Hologram”?

Robin: Thank you Tyler for this very special opportunity. My websites are and and there is much more information there, including reviews, exercises, music, and links to Amazon etc.
I would love readers to join me on the “The Human Hologram” Facebook page, so that together we can reach a new level of awareness about what it is to be human.

Tyler: Thank you, Robin. I feel like my level of awareness has been raised just by conducting this interview with you.                         

Interview with Ernest Dempsey. The Audience Review. 8th edition. Printed here with permission

The Physical World: Reality or Illusion? An Interview
with Dr. Robin Kelly, author of The Human Antenna
by Ernest Dempsey

Mainstream science has long been skeptical, and recklessly
so, of what have come to be called ‘paranormal
phenomena’. The latter have repeatedly been criticized and
discarded as unscientific and fiction, rather than fact. Lack
of objectivity and a plausible, rational explanation have
hindered the acceptance of the paranormal as believable
experiences of mentally sane individuals. But now, we have
a groundbreaking, new approach from Dr. Robin Kelly, a
medical doctor and alternative healing expert, explaining
the unusual phenomena with a fairly plausible hypothesis
(if it can be called so at this point). In his latest book The
Human Antenna (Elite Books, 2007), Dr. Kelly shares
some of the most amazing research studies on the
specialized properties of microtubules and DNA and their
interaction with cosmic energy. Stories of near-death and
out-of-body experiences, xenoglossy, x-ray vision,
telephonic telepathy, and other mind-blowing phenomena
make Dr. Kelly’s book a page turner. After reading it,
you’ll seriously think, for the first time perhaps, of human
beings as more than material bodies and human
consciousness as not confined to brain function. I could
hardly wait to chat with Dr. Kelly about his research and
views on physical existence and cosmic energy, and their
implications for healing illnesses. As expected, our
conversation was exciting and Dr. Kelly’s insight simply

Ernest: Dr. Kelly, please tell our readers briefly about your
academic background, professional experience, and major

Dr. Kelly: I am a formally-trained medical doctor,
graduating from Middlesex Hospital, London University, in
1974. I spent six years in hospital medicine – three of these
in London and three years in Auckland, New Zealand.
During this time I worked in cancer wards, both with adults
and children, as well as doing the usual internships, and
emergency departments etc. I moved into family practice in
Auckland, in 1981, as a proactive step, realizing my
vocation was to treat ‘people rather than diseases.’ I sat the
advanced qualifications for general practice, and
progressed to become a Fellow of the Royal New Zealand
College of General Practitioners. Along the way, I became
president and education convener of the NZ Medical
Acupuncture Society, and a founding trustee of the NZ
MindBody trust. My first book Healing Ways: A Doctor’s Guide to Healing
(Penguin Books, 2000) was released in New Zealand and in
the UK. It explained the ways through which Eastern and
Western philosophies of health could best be integrated. I
focused on the meridian theory and the ‘zang fu’ – how our
organ systems are interlinked, and display mind body and
spiritual characteristics. The other main focus was how best
to introduce the person’s uniqueness into their deep
healing. One chapter focused on modern theories of
healing, with particular reference to quantum theory, nonlocality,
and entanglement. The Human Antenna extended,
and updated, these concepts in 2007; this time with a focus
on the Ayurvedic chakra system, and the growth of human
consciousness. My aim in both books was to present a
thoroughly grounded, straightforward, and practical view of
these concepts, relating to my own experiences with people
at times of challenge, and crisis in their lives.

Ernest: The Human Antenna seems to be deeply inspired
by your research on the interaction of cosmic energy with
living tissues. Now what exactly is energy psychology and
why do you place your work in the realm of ‘psychology’?

Dr. Kelly: It became apparent to me as soon as I started to
use acupuncture in my practice that our bodies are ‘open’
rather than ‘closed’ systems. My training prior to this time
had focused on a theory that our bodies were largely
‘closed off’ from the world around us, and that the best way
to help as a doctor was by introducing a chemical
compound into the body, or by performing surgery. So
firstly I was introduced to the Chinese concepts that
primarily we were ‘energetic’ beings, with a free flow of
natural energy in and out of the body.
Acupuncture was one way to enhance this natural flow. The realization that we are also connected, and in fact contributors, to fields of
information – non local ‘cosmic’ energy, came to me
gradually. I began to notice synchronicities in my life, and
in the lives of those seeking my help. At times there were
major intuitive leaps occurring during an ‘energy balancing
treatment.’ I was also acting as a medical director of a
hospice at this time, and I became aware that those dying
were particularly prone to these experiences. In essence, the
veil between worlds seemed to be lifted at this time. I was
also influenced by the work and writing of Rupert
Sheldrake and Fritjof Capra, with their explanations of the
non material sciences.
However the cosmic connections really hit home with me
when I read about the holographic, fractal nature of our
universe. I had been using ear acupuncture, and reading the
Chinese pulses, for several years prior to this. Here was a
scientific theory that supported the idea that all the
information of the body could be ‘held’ in one small part.
So, for me, the scientific evidence came as a confirmation
of my clinical experiences. Similarly, the scientific
evidence that on the quantum level atoms could be
‘entangled’ came as a confirmation that on a human
‘macro’ levels, our minds, and hearts, could also be
connected outside time and space.
Over recent years, I have been attracted to the Energy
Psychology movement, as it gives people tools to use this
science themselves. At the root of these techniques lies a
compassionate intent towards one’s self. Compassion is at
the heart of non-local connections between individuals,
whether it is telephone telepathy, near death or pre- death
visions, or remote viewing. For energy psychology
techniques to work, compassion needs to be openly
expressed to one’s own self. They represent a practical way
for people to demonstrate a true unconditional personal
ownership of their healing.

Ernest: Do you see humans, and other life forms, as
essentially ‘energy beings’ rather than ‘material beings’?

Dr. Kelly: I regard both as real –with our physical world
being detectable by our senses. However, this physical
dimension is only one representation of a deeper truth. The
fact that all living beings are able to convert the quantum
reality (and yet to be understood dimensions) into our
time/space reality is the true miracle. We are becoming
aware that beyond the grasp of our five senses there exists a
universe existing as a field of universal information. It is
speculated that our physical form is the end result of
interference patterns of information – in nanotechnology
we know that where two coherent beams of light cross,
‘entanglement’ can occur. Similarly the CERN Large
Hadron Collider experiments this year will attempt to
create the Higgs’ boson, commonly referred to as the God
particle, out of subatomic particles (protons), colliding at
great speed. In other words, we have reached a point in
science where we are trying to create mass out of pure
energy. In the Human Antenna, I speculate that this is
exactly what is happening within each of us every second
of our lives.
So there is a growing scientific confirmation of the
Buddhist understanding that our physical world is an
‘illusion.’ There are also several papers in the scientific
literature appearing speculating that we live in a ‘virtual
reality’ universe.
However, it seems those who have this deeper
understanding, also view the physical world as the true
miracle. Knowing all this only makes us want to protect our
earth and its inhabitants even more. It gives us a glimpse of
the sacredness at the core of our being.

Ernest: So what exactly is scalar energy and what is its
role in human life?

Dr. Kelly: Scalar energy, zero point energy, wormholes,
even star gates, are all our limited way of trying to explain
our connection to realms that exist ‘outside’ our concepts
of space and time. It seems that when we reach the very
limits of our earthly dimensions – i.e. as we approach the
speed of light, or a temperature of absolute zero – the hard
rules of known physics seem to be ‘bent.’ Similarly at
times of intense emotional connection i.e. love and loss,
and as part of the dying process, we as humans can glimpse
at other dimensions.
In The Human Antenna, I draw attention to the mobius coil
– a manifestation of the infinity symbol. If an electrical
current is passed through wires assembled in this form, all
the positive and negative currents balance each other out.
Effectively we now have a vacuum produced outside the
confines of electricity or electromagnetic fields – with all
forces of ‘yin’ and ‘yang’ balanced. The analogy here is
that of ‘the eye’ within the vortex of a storm. The double
helix of the DNA and the helical structures we find within
our connective tissue can be regarded as many of these
mobius coils, infinity signs, all joined together. I speculate
that when we, as humans, are in optimum physical and
electrical balance, we are in the best condition to
‘download’ these realms. This has huge significance for our
understanding of both physical healing and the creative
Of course the symbol of the Caduceus, the twin serpents
entwined around the rod of Hermes, is the holographic
representation of all this on the human scale.

Ernest: How can the interaction between DNA and scalar
energy be used in healing patients of some, or any, kinds of

Dr. Kelly: There is speculation that our DNA downloads
‘the field’, and then acts as a four- dimensional projector of
‘biophotonic’ laser light beams of energy. This immensely
complex laser light show forms the holographic matrix or
map upon which physical structure forms. Somehow, this
interacts with the microtubules within our connective tissue
web, which researchers, such as Stuart Hameroff and Roger
Penrose, also hypothesize are converters of these quantum
This of course sounds like science fiction, but there are
reports of this theory being supported by ground breaking
experiments in Russia. One Moscow based biophysicist
Peter Gariaev, has recorded the information from the DNA
of the pancreases of healthy rats, and has ‘projected it’ into
the bodies of diabetic rats whose pancreases have been
poisoned. Healthy pancreases have formed in the diabetic
rats on this new matrix, reversing their diabetes and need
for insulin. Of course, this sort of experiment needs to be
replicated several times to gain scientific credibility. But
there are precious few researchers in the West with a
suitable grounding in biophysics. Also, most research
projects are funded by the biochemical industry.
Although all this sounds very exciting, my own interest lies
more on how this new understanding of our bodies can be
used, everyday, for healing by the person in the street. For
instance: Can we use simple and cheap light and sound
devices to heal? How do positive and negative emotions,
and intent, affect this energetic matrix? Can negative
energy in childhood cause the body to malfunction at this
vital fundamental level, leading to diseases later in life? If
so, how can we influence this process in a positive way?
Can we help in our communities by reducing the
background level of fear and tension?
This grass-roots approach takes the responsibility away
from the research centers, and places it, and the power,
back into our own hands. It is also important that to teach
this to our children at school.

Ernest: The Human Antenna discusses dreams, out of body
experiences, and near death experiences (NDEs) as
scientifically explainable, right?

Dr. Kelly: In the confusing world of consciousness studies,
there can be said to be two ‘camps.’ The first believes that
our consciousness is simply a by-product of our brains – an
epiphenomenon. The second is that we act as filters of
consciousness – which is the information of our universe
and primary, or fundamental, to everything else. Of course,
The Human Antenna model embraces the latter. Those who
favor the first explanation will point at an area of the brain
that shows up on a scan when someone is having an out of
body experience or an NDE and say: ‘Look that proves it;
its all a misperception; it’s all in the head!’ Those of us in
the second camp, say: ‘No, those are only the recording
lights to show us we are downloading something real!’
(Maybe, we will say, the people we meet in NDEs are as
real as the Larry King we see on our TV screen every
Up until now, the scientific community has rather
dogmatically favored the first explanation - that
consciousness is an epiphenomenon. However, it appears,
without any valid scientific proof. My work challenges this
I happen to feel though there may be a middle ground. Our
perceptions certainly influence our world and universe.
This is clear from Einstein’s Special Theory of Relativity
onwards, up until and including the modern theories of
observer physics. For instance what we see through our
eyes is likely a combined effect of light reaching our eyes,
and the perceptions already formed within our brains. So
our conditioning is a major player in our reality. As we
grow consciously and spiritually, we tend to move away
from dogma and see things, literally, in a new light. No
amount of intellectual persuading will convince a hardened
skeptic that the foundations of life are based on energy,
love and consciousness. Our intellects are too bound to our

Ernest: So the upshot of these so-called ‘paranormal’
phenomena is that our consciousness is not confined to our
material being and can live beyond the body. What is your
view on the origin of consciousness? Can it originate
without a physical body?

Dr. Kelly: Yes, when we die, for instance, the recording
apparatus dies, but the consciousness show goes on. I don’t
think any of us, certainly not myself, has any idea about the
true origin of consciousness. In the fractal universe though,
the more we look the more we find. Physicists David
Deutsch and Michio Kaku are now convinced that there are
multiple universes, and that the connections between these
lie both in the macrocosm and the microcosm. In The
Human Antenna appendix, I explore John Wheeler’s theory
of ‘quantum foam’ of space containing an infinite number
of wormholes to other universes. I speculate that this is the
space upon, and from, which we are continuously
manifesting. So clearly our Newtonian concept of time and
space, even our talk of a ‘past, present and future,’ or ‘big
or small,’ doesn’t make much sense when talking about
these other dimensions. All these physicists agree that each
universe will have its own scientific rules.
However, rather than getting lost in all this speculation, I
think it is wonderful that we have reached the point we can
talk this way. In many ways, our perception of the universe
is growing alongside our conscious growth. So maybe, just
maybe, the two are closely linked. We are the co-creators
of all this!
Can consciousness exist without our bodies? Probably yes,
but it is with and through our bodies that we are beginning
to make sense of it all.

Ernest: You place a high value on ancient Chinese and
Hindu traditions of healing that are both based on energy/human
interaction. How do you compare these systems
with modern allopathic approach to healing?

Dr. Kelly: My work and writing are attempts to bring these
apparently differing views of health and healing together.
The allopathic approach to medicine has largely developed
as a result of our rushed Western life style. Recently, I tried
to convince a woman living in New Zealand, but born in
China, to have acupuncture rather than a cortisone injection
for her inflamed tendon. She said she would have the
steroid, as she needed it numbed down quickly as ‘time
meant money.’ So our ‘symptom-quelling’ approach has its
basis as much with the way most people run their lives as
with the mass conditioning of the public by the
pharmaceutical industry. We all need symptom control to
deal with our lives – it is perfectly ok to take an aspirin for
a headache, as long as we take into account its cause.
Similarly, for those in severe pain, or who are terminally
ill, the compassionate symptom controlling approach is
However, the holistic approach of Chinese and Ayurvedic
medicine acknowledges there are underlying deeper
processes at play. In these traditional cultures, many
Western diseases are seen simply as symptoms of a more
fundamental energetic imbalance. So by addressing the
purely ‘physical’ or ‘chemical’ in our Western approach,
one can be accused of neglecting the root energetic causes
of ill health. Certainly the emerging science of biophysics
supports this view. However, we still need to adapt these
systems of energy medicine into a more effective model in
the West. One big hurdle is how in the West we have
defined ‘the placebo.’ In many ways, the intent of the
healer, and of faith and beliefs of the person to be healed, is
paramount to the Ayurvedic and Chinese system of health.
So we need to embrace and understand the role of all these
concepts, and not alienate or belittle them as we have
tended to do. Just because the concept of ‘placebo’ is a
useful yardstick by which we measure the performance of a
pharmaceutical, doesn’t make it an appropriate measure for
those interactive healing arts which embrace compassion,
interaction and faith. In these models, all these elements are
seen as vital to achieving satisfactory outcomes.

Ernest: In healing through cosmic energy, the
psychological states, of the healer and that of the patient,
are important. How does this help in healing?

Dr. Kelly: The healer and the patient together are conduits
for this cosmic energy. They therefore should be in a
harmonious state both within themselves and together. This
is the state of coherence which is so important to healing.
The healer should teach the patient how she or he can do
this her/himself. The HeartMath Institute has been one of
the leading researchers in this field, and we now have-hand
held biofeedback devices that measure the desired state of
coherence in the heart. The heart is the strongest electrical
organ in the body, and hence when in balance the most
potent ‘transceiver’ of this cosmic, scalar energy.
The techniques used to achieve this coherence combine
gentle abdominal breathing with heart awareness exercises.
Developing a sense of well being, joy and compassion in
the region of the heart, while gently breathing in, forms the
basis of profound energy psychology techniques. In joint
sessions, it is important for both healer and healee to
achieve this level of heart balance, preferably together in

Ernest: There was a stage in your professional career when
you decided against practicing hypnotism. Would you like
to tell why?

Dr. Kelly: My goal all along is to help people take true
ownership of their healing. When I learnt hypnotherapy, I
was concerned I may put myself in an ‘overly controlling’
role. At that time in the 80s, I was also learning to meditate, and
practice Qi Gong, and so I felt even teaching ‘selfhypnosis’
didn’t quite fit for where I was at. However, I acknowledge
many find these techniques very useful, and I encourage
them where appropriate. It is very important that
people use their due diligence, and their intuition, when
seeking out a hypnotherapist, especially for past life work. I
see the overriding role of regression work as a healing aid
for this life.

Ernest: Okay, do you mind my asking whether you believe
in God? If so, what is your concept of God?

Dr. Kelly: My own concept of God is an all pervading,
benign, loving connection between all beings. My God is
more of an entity than an identity. It is pure, unconditional
love. It is important I feel, for Energy Psychology
techniques to be most effective, for us to recognize that this
God also resides within; that we are all divine beings.
However, in all healing encounters, we should meet people
where they wish to be met. It is not my role to impose my
understandings of God onto anyone seeking my help. It is
their own God that we call on. I invite all patients to talk
about love and, if they want, about God. It is, on reflection,
rather strange that formal medicine has tended to ignore
something so important and basic to the healing process.

Ernest: Finally, you make mention of feminine values in
religions that are important in effective healing with
universal energy. What are those values and how they work
in healing?

Dr. Kelly: I think one of the most pivotal omissions in both
religious and medical teaching for centuries is an open
recognition of the sacredness of women. Western religious
teaching has tended to distance women from their
spirituality – witness how women have for centuries felt
more comfortable giving than receiving. This has had a
huge impact on women’s health – in particular, their
immune systems. The auto immune conditions of rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis and lupus all affect
women in greater numbers than men. Guilt, poor self –
esteem, and poor financial rewards, have all taken their toll.
These issues are also prominent in women with breast
cancer – a heart-chakra condition involving the organ that
nurtures others. The role of emotions in health has been
well know to women, but has until recently ignored by our
health systems. The Energy Psychology techniques, which
are really an open expression of self love, are a godsend for
women who inherently seem to understand these issues
more than men.
However, I am confident that we are witness to a time of
great change, and growth in our consciousness. This
awareness is being fed to me everyday through the people –
women, men and children -seeking my help. They continue
to be my most profound and patient teachers.

Ernest: Thank you very much Dr. Kelly for your time and
sharing your wisdom!